451-050 Grandfather Clock Dial

451-050 Grandfather Clock Dial

$130.00

-

451-050 Grandfather Clock Dial

Clock moon dial for the 451-050 westminster and chain driven Hermle grandfather clock movements. 11 x 15 1/2 with Arabic numerals on a silver chapter ring that is 10 inches wide.

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MDMOON: $130.00
Grandfather Clock Moon Dials - Grandfather and grandmother clock phase of the moon dials spin one month per revolution. - Clockworks
Moon DialsMoon Dial OrderingRemoving the HandsMoon Dial InstallationMoon Dial History
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Moon Dial, Grandfather Clock Dial, history of moon dial, clockworks.com

Grandfather Clock Moon Dial Ordering

Read this section before ordering a new moon dial for the grandfather clock. There are specific things to know so as not to purchase the wrong dial for your clock. Not all moon dials fit all clocks.

In essence, each one is made for a specific clock movement. The reason being most moon dials have four feet, or posts, that stick out of the back of the dial. These feet have to lock into the movement.

If the feet are in a different location, it will not lock into the movement. These grandfather clock moon dials are for post WW2 clocks only.

how to identify clock movement, clock markings, numbers on back of clock

How to get the right moon dial

First, locate the movement number to get the correct moon dial. Without the movement number, finding a compatible dial will be impossible. So this is an important first step. The movement number can be found on the back plate of the movement itself.

It will not be on any of the paperwork that came with the clock, or on the wood case. Movement numbers can only be found on the clockworks itself. Often customers will email pictures of stickers that are on the back of the clock. However this is not where the movement number will be.

So please save yourself some time and make sure to get the numbers that are on the back plate of the brass movement. Match up the movement numbers to the ones in the list on the moon dial description.

get a new moon dial, what dial do I need for my clock, moon dials, where to buy moon dials

What has to match

  • The posts on the back of the dial need to lock into the movement. A long hand shaft on the movement will require longer posts. In other words, the posts on the back of the dial make it so the hand shaft will stick out far enough to put the clock hands on.
  • If the movement is cable driven, the holes to wind the clock need to be in the right spot. This is important for when it comes time to wind the clock with the key or crank. When the alignment is correct, it will go onto the winding arbor of the movement. If the alignment is not correct, then winding will be difficult or even impossible.
  • Some clocks have a second hand bit which also needs to have a perfect alignment. This goes onto the small post coming off of the escape wheel. Simply push on the second hand to install it.

On a chain driven unit, it is possible to get any moon dial and remove the feet off the clock dial.

The dial would then have to attach to the wood case. Since a chain driven movement has no winding arbors, there are no holes to match up. There is also rarely a second hand bit.

So you can use any dial with no winding holes and attach it to the wood case. However, one thing to mention is that the moon phase will most likely no longer spin.

chain driven, clock movement
The content of this website is copyright by Clockworks and written by James Stoudenmire in year 2022

Removing Mechanical Clock Hands

Removing Mechanical Clock Hands is fast and easy to do. The following are hand removal instructions for German mechanical movements post WW2.

German Post WW2 wall, mantle and floor models

Removing mechanical clock hands for post WW2, mantle and floor clocks is quite simple. Turn the hand nut to the left while holding the minute hand with your fingers.

Use some small needle nose pliers to loosen the nut first. Once the nut is loose, turn it with your fingers until it comes off.

Then the minute hand will be able to wiggle straight off its square arbor and off of the clock. The hour hand is a friction fit, so just twist the hour hand back and forth and pull toward you until it comes off.

If having a second hand bit, that is only a friction also, so just grab it with your fingernails, twist and pull off.

American Antique time and strike

These type of movements come in two styles. If there is a minute hand nut, the first style is the same as above.

Be very careful not to lose this hand nut. They are very hard to find and replace. The second style of mechanical clock hands will have a pin holding the minute hand on instead of a nut.

This pin tapers, meaning it's fat on one side and skinny on the other. Just grab the fat side with needle nose pliers and yank the pin out. The minute hand will fall out with a washer.

Save the washer and the tapered pin for ease of reinstalling the hands. If these items happen to get lost, Clockworks offers washers and taper pins for purchase, as well as replacement mechanical clock hands.

The content of this website is copyright by Clockworks and written by James Stoudenmire in year 2022

Grandfather Clock Moon Dial Installation

A Grandfather clock moon-dial installation explanation is in this section. Thus, this is written for a new movement installation in mind.

However can use it for any post WW2 German mechanical unit with issues in relation to the front of the movement.

The moon gear

Install the moon gear onto the new movement prior to the clock moon-dial installation. It mounts with a set screw and sits on the same tube as the hour hand.

Install this onto the new unit. Of course it has to be the same as it was on the old movement. Ideally, with the same approximate distance on the hand shaft. In essence, this will allow it to run the gears behind the clock moon-dial and therefore run the phase of the moon.

The selector switch

A selector switch is a steel arm that is about 1 to 2 inches in length with a set screw. In short, the purpose of the switch is to select the song or silence the clock. Install the selector switch on the arm which is on the right side of the movement.

In other words, slide the switch over the larger arm and secure it with the set screw. It only has to be able to come through the slot at the 3 o'clock position for the user to move it up or down on the clock moon-dial.

Before install, check this

These modern clock movements from Germany use a rack and snail count system for the strike. Be sure the rack tail for the strike is on top of the snail instead of stuck behind it. See pictures that illustrate the correct and incorrect positions.

Simply lift the rack back up into position with fingers. If this is not done the clock may not run, chime, or strike. It is important to get this done before completing the grandfather clock moon-dial installation.

Grandfather clock moon dial installation

The clock moon-dial has four posts on the back that lock into the front plate of the movement. Line up the clock hand shaft to the hole in the center of the dial. Then line up the posts with the holes in the movement.

There are two ways to secure the four dial posts to the clock movement. One way has locking arms on the back of the front plate of the movement that slide over the end of the dial post to lock it tight. This is if both the clock moon-dial and the movement are made this way.

The other way this is done is if there are holes in the ends of the dial post feet. These use a pin to secure it to the movement. A tapered pin will go through the hole in the post after it's on the front plate of the movement.

Grandfather Clock Moon Dial

Moon Gear

Grandfather Clock Moon Dial

Moon Gear Mesh

Incorrect Rack

Rack Incorrect

Correct Rack

Rack is Correct

The content of this website is copyright by Clockworks and written by James Stoudenmire in year 2022

Clock Moon Dial History

The phase of the moon is still popular on modern mechanical clock movements. It is interesting to know the clock moon dial history as to why and when the it became such a popular feature to add to grandfather clocks.

Why it began

In the late 1600's traveling took awhile and was also hazardous at night when it was dark. The people would depend on the light of the moon to see what they are doing when they were out.

The phase of the moon function was an addition to the floor clocks for this purpose. People could make travel plans with the moon light helping them to see.

Developments

In the 1700's clocks began to have the hump on the top of the clock dial for the moon phase. The dial arch was able to accommodate the lunar display disk.

The moon was painted on the disk and the disk would rotate once a month. It was a simple and practical addition to the clock.

Alternate Animations in the Clock moon dial History

Some clock dials with the arch were made with alternate animations besides the moon phase. Ships and jumping deer figures among other things would rock back and forth. These animations did not have any practical functionality as the phase of the moon did.

It was a simple design in connection to the pendulum motion. With the swing of the pendulum, the animation would rock.

That is the history of the clock moon dial in its simplest form. It is always interesting to see how people live and rely so heavily on their clocks back then.

In the days of outhouses and traveling with horse and buggy, a clock was an important appliance.

The content of this website is copyright by Clockworks and written by James Stoudenmire in year 2022

451-050 Grandfather Clock Dial

Clock moon dial for the 451-050 westminster and chain driven Hermle grandfather clock movements. 11 x 15 1/2 with Arabic numerals on a silver chapter ring that is 10 inches wide. The four dial feet on the back of the dial mount into the movement itself. Has the silent and chimes listed at 3 o'clock for the switch.

Additional information

Weight2 lbs

35
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Doug Anderson
Doug Anderson
1 month ago

My clock, the nut will not come off. The shaft keeps turning. I’m holding the hands, turning counter clock wise.

Robert
Robert
2 months ago

If I have to replace the gear with the pin in it where can I get one

Robert
Robert
2 months ago

On a moon dial the three gears that are behind in the back does the top gear have a pen to go through to turn the moon dial if so mine is missing how can I fix it

Ray Smith
Ray Smith
11 months ago

How do you attach a square dial with just a centre hole drilled to a hermle 451 053H movement please

Ray Smith
Ray Smith
11 months ago

It’s 250 mm X 250mm it sits about 1inch all round from top sides and bottom Ray

Chris
Chris
1 year ago

I am looking for the moving moon dial plate number 7370A with the Westminister chime movement number 3600X. are they still made and if not what is the next best substitute??
Chris

Chris
Chris
1 year ago

hello

Jared Wetzel
Jared Wetzel
1 year ago

Will this fit on to 03124 urgos

Rick
Rick
2 years ago

I inherited a Pearl Grandfather Clock with a Hermle 1151-050H movement with a moondial. The moondial is run with 3 plastic gears. The first one is missing. I have been looking for these gears, with no luck. Is it possible to purchase replacement gears?

Linda Anderson
Linda Anderson
2 years ago

I have a Howard Miller clock that I need a new moon dial face for but I’m not seeing any numbers on it

Linda S. Anderson
Linda S. Anderson
2 years ago

uw32062b 995474

Linda S. Anderson
Linda S. Anderson
2 years ago

I need the clock face for this movement

Ernie Steigerwalt
Ernie Steigerwalt
3 years ago

Does the moon dial have holes for back lighting

Joe Mackey
Joe Mackey
3 years ago

I purchased a new Moon Dial for my clock that has the 451-050 movement. It does not have holes for backlighting. Since the clock did not have a moon dial originally, I had to order a 30-tooth gear to run the moon phases. It works great and looks fantastic. Thanks for the help with the install.

Joe Mackey
Joe Mackey
4 years ago

Can you retro-fit the 451-050 moon dial face onto the same movement that currently does not have a moon dial?

I Have a Howard Miller Grandfather clock with the 451-050 (74CM) movement that i would like to update with a moon dial.

Thank you.

Matt
Matt
4 years ago

Is there anywhere that I can get a clock dial with moon phase dial for a mantel clock?

STEPHANIE FRANKHAUSER
STEPHANIE FRANKHAUSER
4 years ago

Will this dial fit 1181-8538? Is it possible to get winding holes without second hand bit?