Please view these information tabs to learn about Hermle Clock Movement 140/141 series.
Hermle 140 / 141 Clock Movement
Hermle 140 / 141 Clock Movement comes in either the pendulum or non pendulum styles. Such as the pendulum unit 141-040 or the non pendulum balance wheel version such as the 140-010. This is a fourteen day unit, it runs the 14 days on a single wind up. They used to be made to run 8 days only. If the numbers are with a 5 instead like 151 or 150-xxx its an 8 day wind. All they did to make this happen was put a longer mainspring in the barrel, so if you have a 151 or 150 unit, the new unit to replace this is a 141 or 140-xxx instead. The rest of the numbers are consistent with the old, just match them up.
Hermle 140 / 141 Clock Movement series are all spring driven with 85 x 98mm plate size. They all take a #8 size clock key. What is being offered on this page is the movement only with out the pendulum, gong or dial. It will come as the movement itself with its hand nut, and if a pendulum unit it comes with the suspension spring and leader. The 141-040, 141-030, and a 141-033 all comes with a calendar. It is required to remove this calendar if you do not have the days of the month on your dial. Its easy, its just removing excess things so its not so involved. See the other tab about how to remove your calendar.
The time from deciding to repair the clock, to having it done is the very least it could be.It will ship out the next business day, unless its a special gearing. If this is the situation it will take about 4 days to ship as the movement. This is because the movement comes apart and put together with special gears. You can tell if its a regear unit if it has an extra charge on the movement that cost more than the rest of the movements. The choice is clear to get the new one instead of overhauling the old unit. You would get the movement in a week or two instead of months later, it will cost about a third the amount of a typical overhaul charge also.
Clock Movement 141-040 141-070 Compatibility
The compatibility between the clock movement 141-040 and 141-070 needs explanation and clarification. At one point in time the same number was used for both versions .
What is the difference between the 040 and the 070 Hermle units? The 040 series has a one hammer on the back whereas the 070 units have two bells on the back.
It is common to get an 070 as a replacement for an 040 gong strike. This is because the two units are cross compatible. To make it a gong strike, you only need to remove one of the hammers with its wire and take off the bells. The reasoning behind this is simply the cost of importing the movements from Germany. There are minimum purchase requirements for each series. So it only makes sense to import one series that is cross compatible. In most cases the customer leaves the bells and ditches the gong as the sound is better.
What is even more confusing is that there was a time when the 141-070 had a gong strike or a bell strike. It was the same number for both types. So what was previously known as a 141-070 is now referred to as a 141-070141-040. So, if you have a 141-070 see if it has one hammer on the back that strikes a gong, or if it has bells on the back. If you have the bells get the 141-070 and if it has a gong order the 141-040.
Clock Movement Calendar Removal
Many of these units come with a calendar as indicated by the letter K after the movement numbers. This is the usual way some movements are supplied by the manufacturer. This way it covers movements with and without a calendar. In this way only one style is to be made, shipped, and stored ready to ship. So sometimes the new movement only comes into the country with a calendar attached. The below information will enable you to remove the calendar portion if needed to do so for the installation. Such as if the calendar tube is in the way of installing the new movement to the dial.
If you look at the new movement you will see two hex nuts on the front of the clock holding a small plate with gears under it. You will see that your old unit does not have this. Take these hex nuts off, and the plate, and slide the big gear off of the hand shaft. This big gear is just for the calendar.
There is a small C clip that blocks the hour hand tube from coming off. Remove the C clip with a small flat screwdriver and the hour hand tube will come off. Do the same thing with your old unit and put the old unit hour hand tube on the new unit. Note the exact position of the new movement’s hour tube. This position is important to note before taking it off and put the old unit’s hour tube in the exact position. What is meant by position is the humps on the snail looking portion that is attached to the hour hand tube. This has to be the same position on the new one just like it was on the old. If it is not the same then the hourly strikes will be off. The deepest slot is 12 o’clock and the highest hump is 1 o’clock.
The mounting posts where the hex nuts were located are still on the clock movement. Now if these are in the way of mounting your movement to your dial, they would need to be removed. The clock movement calendar removal would require these to be snapped off. This may seem harsh but if you get a pair of pliers and bend them down and up, they will snap off. This is because these posts are only pressed in by machine and there is no other way to remove them. This is the intent of the factory to have done, when needed.
Strike Count Reset
It is time to test the strikes and see if they are correct and that you have the hour hand tube in the correct position. Make the clock strike and count how many times it strikes. If you have one o’clock and 12 o’clock strike correct its all set. Tf it strikes 1 and 12 out with the correct number of strikes, then the rest is ok also.
If this is too much information then you can send in the old unit and the new unit and we will swap it out at for a charge of $30 Plus shipping.
About Hermle Clock Movements
Hermle clock movements are among the finest movements made in the modern times. The German made Hermle units typically work night and day for 30 years without much complaint. To go and get it overhauled like you normally would with any clock after a long time, it is found that is cost is high. This is for good reason as it can be a large task to restore it. But as you see, since its a modern day unit (Post War German) it can be available new for a very good price. So what happens is you get a new movement instead of a fixed up old one, you get it in 3 days instead of 6 months. You will save hundreds of dollars doing it also.
All the Hermle clock movements clockworks.com offers is the best grade. In other words there are a couple styles some units have that are not as good as others. There are various movements that have more than one grade. Some units can have plastic for the hour hand tube and the next wheel down, instead the better brass. Meanwhile the number is the same for both grades. In other words there is the economy grade and there is the full grade, on some movement series. Please know that clockworks.com will only ship the best grade Hermle clock movement available, every time.
What you will receive
Each one of the these fine Hermle clock movements come already oiled, will come with the hand nut also. If it is a pendulum style clock, it will come with the suspension spring and the pendulum hanger (leader). If its a weight driven clock, it will come with new chains or cables and with pulleys. So this will be the movement with its hammer assemble on. This is the complete movement that comes out after you get in your hands and walk away from the clock with it. No weights, pendulum, chime block, hands, dial all this you have already usually.
When you place your online order you will get a receipt emailed to you providing you put in the correct email address. If you do not get a receipt, please check your spam folder for the receipt from us. On the receipt is the link to click for the instructions for your product. The Hermle clock movement ships from Huntington, MA 01050 USA and sometimes from other locations also. The movements go out the next business day unless there is something we have to do to it such as a regear. The Hermle Clock Movements ship out UPS or sometimes FedEx. Never USPS unless there is a special request or you are an international customer.
Hermle Clock Pendulum Measuring
If a Hermle clock doesn't keep proper time, the pendulum may be incorrect. To determine if this is the problem, all of the components of the Hermle clock pendulum need to be measured. Hermle clock pendulum measuring is extremely important. Often enough the CM length stamped on the movement is not the actual pendulum length. Certainly, the CM stamp provides valuable information, however it does not state what the Hermle clock pendulum needs to be from tip to tip. This section describes what the CM stamp represents, as well as how it needs to be measured.
What the CM represents
To measure a Hermle clock pendulum, start at the very top of the movement. Continue all the way down to the bottom of the rating nut on the pendulum. The CM number will only be accurate to the pendulum length if the bob diameter is small. In other words, the larger, or the heavier, the bob is, the longer the pendulum needs to be despite the stamped length on the movement. If confused, please email [email protected] in order to determine the best pendulum length. Please provide the CM length stamped on the back plate of the movement. Also, include the width of the pendulum bob. The bob is the round disk at the bottom of the pendulum.
Parts that are measured
The pendulum length (**cm) is the distance from the suspension post all the way down. Meaning to the bottom of the pendulum nut threads. This measurement includes the pendulum from tip to tip, the leader it hangs on, and the suspension spring. This pendulum length will not always be the same as what is marked on the movement. Subsequently there are also other factors that play into this measurement. For instance, the pendulum bob diameter. The larger the pendulum bob diameter, the longer the pendulum length needs to be despite the CM length.
In conclusion, if the CM length on the old unit matches the CM length on the new unit it will keep proper time with the same pendulum. There are times when the old leader needs to be used on the new movement, but this is not common.
Mechanical Clock Movement Wear
Mechanical clock movement wear after years go by because the oil turns solid. With age, the mechanical clock movement's oil solidifies and becomes black and sticky. By the time 20 or 30 years go by, the oil has solidified and is creating wear on the movements brass plates.
What wear and where
If you look at your old clock movement, you will see holes in the brass plates where there are small pivot arbors sticking into these holes. These pivots are what the gears of the clock ride upon and as the pivots spin in the solidified oil, this makes the holes oblong instead of round. With the pivot holes oblong, the holes are pinching the pivots and creating resistance in the gear train. With the solidified oil and the pinched pivots, the clock will eventually stop working or chiming.
Invisible clock movement wear
This wear takes place in the holes that are in the brass plates and is hard to identify sometimes. These holes in the brass plates become oblong instead of round and this pinches the pivot arbor going into it. Between this, and the solid oil, the clock ceases to function. To have this repaired is an expensive and long process. To have a mechanical movement serviced can cost two times as much or even three times the amount of the new one.
New Clock Movement Benefits
Getting the movement worked on
Clocks need to be oiled after 10 years or so. Then, after 20 or 30 years, a full break down of the movement is necessary. This is all well and good and can be done with the old movement. The movement will run for another 5 or 15 years with no issues but then it will be time to do it again.
Every time the movement is worked on and re-bushed, it will last less and less time before it needs attention again. The repair process is expensive because it takes time to separate the plates, remove all the gears, do the necessary work, and then put them all back together again. This process may need to be redone if not perfect the first time. The turn around time to complete an overhaul could be anywhere from 1 to 3 months, and in some extreme cases, a year. It is a slow moving venture that costs twice as much as a new movement would. If a new movement is not available, then this is the best, and only, way to handle a clock repair.
Replacing with a new clock movement
If the movement is still in production, it is far better to just get the new one. Mass production makes the movement so affordable it will cost a fraction of the price of the repair work. The movement will be the same one but brand new and ready to run 30 years without much complaint. There is absolutely no way to repair an old movement so that it is better than new. Even the best clockmaker using the best equipment cannot make the movement better than a new one.
A new one is a factory fresh restart. The clock will be like it was originally when it was purchased from the store. The new movement will be made by the same people, with the same machines, and the movement is the same. It is not a close replica or made somewhere else besides Germany. It is the same movement. Not a knock off or replica. So wouldn't it make sense to get the new one instead of chasing the old? The choice is clear and obvious. The new movement will cost a fraction of the price and the clock is up and running in no time.
Movements to consider getting repaired instead
If a unit is no longer in production and not available new, then a repair is most likely your only option. However we will try to convert it to a new unit that is close and easy to adapt. If it is not an easy one to adapt, or would take too much case work, then the best solution is to get it worked on.
Another movement to consider getting overhauled instead of replaced is the tubular bell, which is a high end movement. The price of a tubular bell unit makes an overhaul more attractive. This is because of the high price on the new ones which is currently around $1600. Usually the price is less for the new unit but instead these units are more costly than the overhaul by clockworks.com anyway. We can charge only $900 for the complete overhaul on these units. Ultimately the choice is yours. There is a good argument in both directions that makes sense on these expensive units.
Clockworks.com = The best repair service
We would love to do the overhaul here at clockworks.com and we do the best job. There are two ways to fix clocks; the easy way and the hard way. We only do it the hard way with no short cuts. It is even more important for us to do your repair than another company because we do not go to your house. There is no one being intrusive in your home and possibly damaging your clock case.
The movement itself is the only item that gets sent to us. No components need to be sent since we have everything else here such as weights, dials and pendulums. It is a great advantage to have clockworks.com work on your movement for this fact alone. A clock supply depot such as us does not need to wait for parts. We possess everything we could possibly need to complete a thorough, professional clock repair right here.
The new movement
New clock movement benefits usually do indeed outweigh the repair option. The movement will already come lubricated with clock oil so there is no need to oil it. The clock comes with cables and pulleys, or chains, the leader, and suspension spring. This is everything that comes out when you remove the two screws that are under the movement, besides the dial and weights.
Once you get the hands and the clock dial out of the way (instructions included) it's only a matter of removing the two screws from underneath. The new movement can be swapped out by an experienced person in 10 or 15 minutes. An inexperienced person will take longer, but the point is that it isn't hard to do. There are some instances where a clock case was made in an annoying way that makes it more difficult, but for mass produced clocks this is not the situation. This more related to a few individual clockmakers who may have designed the case to make it more tricky to get the movement in or out.
A new clock movement is typically less than half the cost of an overhaul. It will also be on its way to the customer instantly instead of months later. A new clock movement will last the longest of any other choice.
Hermle Clock Movement Aliases
Hermle produced clock movements and used aliases for names in a way. The movement could be stamped many names but really it will be made by Hermle. Some companies bought so many they were able to get there name on the movement instead of Hermle. The following is only a partial list of names that could be on the clock movement.
The best disguised Aliases
Seth Thomas also Mason and Sullivan had not only there name, also there own internal numbering system. This was stamped on the movement, instead of the Hermle number. Since it is not a Hermle number, the number would need to be converted to what the real number is . This is done with the Mason and Sullivan chart, or the Seth Thomas conversion Chart. However the Seth Thomas chart is not very accurate, please see instructions on that page.
Best to replace the movement
It is best to replace the clock movement if either of these names are on the movement automatically. You do not have to think and decide if repair is better, the answer is a simple no. These companies went out of business long ago and the unit is over its lifetime. The lifetime is 25 - 30 years before it needs an overhaul or replacement. Both ST and Mason Sullivan on the movement would indicate the clock is about 40 years old.
The other Hermle Clock Movement Aliases are easy
Hermle Clock Movement Aliases on other clocks used only their name, and not there own internal numbering system on the Hermle movements. So basically if the clock is of post war German origin you can just look at the number and forget the name. The numbers will indicate what movement it is. If it is a Hermle movement its 3 or 4 digits followed by a hyphen, and then 3 more digits. Like this 1161-853 or 340-020 or 351-060. If the numbers look like this it is made by Hermle.
Other Names Used
- S. Larose
- Mason & Sullivan
- Tally Industries
- Seth Thomas
- Howard Miller
Hermle Number Examples
Below are some typical examples of the Hermle clock movement numbering system. If your clock numbers are similar to this, its made by Hermle.
- 451-050 94cm
- 451-030 66cm
- 341-020 45cm
- 1151-050 114cm
- 451-053 94cm
- 1161-853 114cm
- 141-070 45cm
- 351-050 55cm
- 1161-850 94cm
- 241-070 94cm
Hermle Clock Movement
The numbers on the back plate of the movement is everything one needs to get a replacement. If the numbers match then the Hermle Clock Movement matches.
If the clock is a pendulum unit, be sure to select the proper CM length that matches the old unit.
- 33.2mm Hand shaft
- Pendulum Unit
- 1 Hammer Back
- Gong Strike
- A fraction of the price of an overhaul
- Should last 25-30 years, an overhaul would not
- Instructions and expert support
- Ships same day as ordered
- Hermle Of Germany Made
141-023 Hermle Clock Movement
Please note, the 141-023 Hermle Clock Movement comes in front or rear pendulum options. This 141-023 Hermle Clock Movement is the rear pendulum unit, if you need the front pendulum we offer that also. The 141-023 Hermle Clock Movement runs 14 days on a single wind up. It has a bottom strike hammer that will strike out the hours a the top of the hour, and strike once for the half hour. The 141-023 Hermle Clock Movements has a 85 x 98mm outer plate measurement. This high quality German movement comes oiled and includes its leader, suspension spring and hand nut. They all take a #8 size clock key.
Ordering a Hermle Clock Movement
The numbers off of the back plate of the movement itself are needed when ordering a Hermle clock movement. The numbers are matched up so the new movement will be exactly the same as the old one. Replacing the movement is a fraction of the price of a repair. It is also the fastest way to get the clock up and running again.
Clock movement removal and installation
Removing and installing the clock movement requires the most basic tools. If you can change the spark plug on your lawn mower, this will be a breeze. All of the Hermle clock movements are in stock and ship immediately. We are full time clock makers and retailers. This means we can help you from start to finish. If you need assistance in picking out the correct Hermle clock movement, installation or troubleshooting, we can help. Please do not hesitate to ask.
Matching the CM when ordering
This note only applies if your Hermle clock movement has a pendulum. You will need to match up the CM length from the back plate of your old unit to the new one. The options in the drop down menu ultimately indicate stock items that are available. However, if there is a CM number you need that is not listed, we can usually create it by changing some gears. If this is the situation please give us a call 800 381 7458. There is an extra fee for regearing the movement. Usually this is an additional fee of $30 to $40.
Replacing a movement is less costly than an overhaul. The movement will last another 25 years before needing any work. Since it is still in production, and offered at a very reasonable price, it makes sense to replace the movement. The clock will be problem free right away, instead of months. Plus it will inevitably last longer than an overhaul. There is no way you can get better than brand new. So please make the wise decision of replacing whenever possible.
Hermle Clock Movement Directory Explanation
Hermle Clock Movement Directory is to get to the correct page that contains your clock movement. The Hermle mechanical movements have numbers on the back plate starting with the below few numbers, and then followed by a - dash and then some more numbers. Examples = 340-020 131-070 1161-853 351-020 and similar. So if your clock says something like 1161-053 you would drop the second half and click the 1161 button below. This will bring you to the page where 1161-053 and the rest of the 1161 series resides.
Hermle Clock Movement Directory, Number starts with.....
If Not Listed
If your Hermle movement is not found on these pages we may still have it as a conversion or we maybe able to create it out of what exists. Please email your movement number or a picture of the back plate to [email protected] If your movement numbers do not look like the Hermle movement numbers as described it maybe made by someone else. The mechanical movement identification page will assist you with determining who made the clock. This is for post WW2 modern mechanical clock movements made in Germany only however.